making the best of an Autotragic Transmission at the 1/4

[PSUsouthpaw]

Like the thread title advertises, I am looking to make the best of being stuck with an auotragic tranny when going to the track.



One way of improving it is to upgrade to a high stall torque converter, for around $500.
www.levelten.com

One must, of course is an automatic transmission cooler, which I am planning to install as soon as its monetarily feasible. This helps to greatly reduce operating temperatures associated with any harsh driving, and to prolong the life of the tranny and the fluid within.

Anyh other suggestions? (swapping in a manual is an idea, but thats its own thread and story.)

[mrphotoman]

What mods do you have first of all.


My auto is slow as hell too.

[j0hnh0lmes]

I have an auto also....you do know the hold brake and gas thing right?


It's not really that slow anymore...CAI helps alot...along with the OBX UDP

[PSUsouthpaw]

yup, I know of that trick.

Current mods include intake, exhaust, (headers and obx udp sitting here waiting on garage time to install, porte intake manifolds on the way)

I'm hoping to make this thread the one that all the auto drivers come to to make the best of their trannies.

[j0hnh0lmes]

ah....I see I've posted a few helpful Topics for intakes and suspension already...

[mrphotoman]

Here is mine, my best run to date is 13.24@104.5, slooooooooooo

http://www.mrphoto.nt-uploader.com/Movie_0004.wmv

me vs mustang gt
I ran out of ice so on this run the car is hot. I dropped 1.6mph and up 1/10 second on my time due to the added heat. (P.S. my custom icebox works great!!!!)
http://justchil.net/wvstreets/_INCOMING/mrphotoman_1337_2.MPG

Thanks, I will have some good quality vid of my best run later tonight or tomorrow. Here is one of me racing a pro street car on slicks. Look how I start catching him at the end. This was one of my slowest runs that night too:
http://justchil.net/wvstreets/_INCOMING/mrphotoman_1354_2.MPG

[PSUsouthpaw]

Here is mine, my best run to date is 13.24@104.5, slooooooooooo

http://www.mrphoto.nt-uploader.com/Movie_0004.wmv

me vs mustang gt
I ran out of ice so on this run the car is hot. I dropped 1.6mph and up 1/10 second on my time due to the added heat. (P.S. my custom icebox works great!!!!)
http://justchil.net/wvstreets/_INCOMING/mrphotoman_1337_2.MPG

Thanks, I will have some good quality vid of my best run later tonight or tomorrow. Here is one of me racing a pro street car on slicks. Look how I start catching him at the end. This was one of my slowest runs that night too:
http://justchil.net/wvstreets/_INCOMING/mrphotoman_1354_2.MPG

Are you boosted?

[nul7]

Are you boosted?

He's got a modified Alpine S/C Stage 2.9999999999999999999999++++. Although, with all he's done to it, it should be called a Stage 72 or something. lol

[PSUsouthpaw]

He's got a modified Alpine S/C Stage 2.9999999999999999999999++++. Although, with all he's done to it, it should be called a Stage 72 or something. lol

That explains much.

[mrphotoman]

Yeah it is sort of a mutant setup, lol.

Don't hate on your auto too much, it can handle a lot of power :)

[PSUsouthpaw]

I thought it was only like 200 whp or so?

I heard from my friend Matt (indafastln) that somewhere on newtiburon theres a guy with an auto thats got like two tranny coolers and its owner watches the trans temp gauge like a hawk...might you be the same person?

[bms231]

What mods do you have first of all.


My auto is slow as hell too.


bahahahaha

[bms231]

try not to knock the auto too much. for doing s/c power it is great b/c it can handle the power, you are not going to spin your wheels as much b/c of the longer gears as say if you had a s/c 6sp, and if you are in bracket racing your car is going to be deadly consistant which is a good thing.

[mrphotoman]

I thought it was only like 200 whp or so?

I heard from my friend Matt (indafastln) that somewhere on newtiburon theres a guy with an auto thats got like two tranny coolers and its owner watches the trans temp gauge like a hawk...might you be the same person?


LMAO no I do not have any tranny coolers, no I do not watch the tranny like a hawk and I am well over 200whp (close to 300whp) and no problems at all. I just drove nearly 700 miles round trip and raced the car all the way up, then at the track and all the way back with zero problems.

[WhiskiTangoFxtrt]

Awesome to see my auto has potential

[cclngthr]

The issue with these transmissions, they won't work well with aftermarket parts. Level 10 claims to have parts, but they don't necessarily work with our transmission. They do for the older, Mitsubishi drivetrain, but the Hyundai, they don't work as intended.

[mrphotoman]

The issue with these transmissions, they won't work well with aftermarket parts. Level 10 claims to have parts, but they don't necessarily work with our transmission. They do for the older, Mitsubishi drivetrain, but the Hyundai, they don't work as intended.

Lol where did you get your info? Several auto tibs are running the level 10 torque converters with no problems at all.

[PSUsouthpaw]

The issue with these transmissions, they won't work well with aftermarket parts. Level 10 claims to have parts, but they don't necessarily work with our transmission. They do for the older, Mitsubishi drivetrain, but the Hyundai, they don't work as intended.

Which are you referring to, the torque converters or the valve body parts?

[mrphotoman]

the torque converters work fine.

[cclngthr]

Which are you referring to, the torque converters or the valve body parts?

Both.

I have had much discussion about the transmission with a HMC engineer, who tests these units before they go into production and after where they are put through some modifications. He also teaches service techs about the cars, engines, transmissions (basically the whole car). Like the engines, which are real finicky with oiling and parts, the trans is the same way. It may work for a while (aftermarket kits), but these kits don't *fit* exactly like they should. On the long term, they will fail sooner than they should.

I had thought about doing this since my shop has replaced quite a few auto trans where customers have serviced their trans using non-authorized parts and this destroyed the transmission. However, I was not happy with what I heard from Level 10. Since Hyundai dynos their remans before they leave the factory, I know the factory units work as designed. With the level 10 unit, I never know if it will work right. Time is money. I go with something that is proven. I go with the factory reman because it has been tested and dynoed prior to delivery.

You have to understand how these operate. They shift differently than other transmissions. Rather than sliding through gears, this unit first grabs the higher gear to *spin up* that gear before releasing the lower gear. When you modify the trans using a higher pressure system, you also risk damaging the operation of the trans case and the internals. The clutch packs are made of rubber and glass. That friction material is not like what is used on other transmissions (which is carbon fiber and steel). The glass makes the Hyundai version somewhat more durable than the carbon fiber and steel (since it is ceramic based and can handle heat better). However, the shifting of it has to be different so it will last. When you modify it, it will change how it shifts and it can reduce the longetivity of the trans and reduce its life.

The factory units are designed to last over 100,000 miles or more. Level 10 can't guarantee their product will make it last that long. When I replace a trans, I do expect it to last as long as it is designed for.

[PSUsouthpaw]

So is there any effective way to upgrade the automatic that will be trustworthy and last for awhile?

[metalfetish]

first, i want a s/c!
second, look at the WING on the ****ing mustang!!
third, i love your car.

[bms231]

hmm..... trans talk. my auto trans has 14K miles on it. say if i am doing 60mph and i put the peddal to the floor. it drops into 3rd and just around 80 it is ready to shift, it attempts and takes about 3 seconds before it goes into gear. it goes in smooth... just takes a while to get into gear. o, then when i am just driving around city if i accelerate say from 30mph and let off the gas it slams into 4th. depends on different situations. sometimes smooth. sometimes hard. always long at high speeds.

[KeWLKaT]

Damn, am I the only one with a manual tranny here? LOL

[cclngthr]

So is there any effective way to upgrade the automatic that will be trustworthy and last for awhile?

A trans cooler and an in-line TRANSMISSION oil filter is your best bet to keep it functioning for a long time. I had both on my XD, but have not done this to the HD yet. The HD fluid capacity is 15 quarts from bone dry and the cooling on this trans, stock is much better than the XD. The XD fluid capacity is 12 quarts from bone dry.

I probably will hold off on the oil cooler on my HD because it seems to be slower at warming up than the XD. I likely will add the filter on the HD.

hmm..... trans talk. my auto trans has 14K miles on it. say if i am doing 60mph and i put the peddal to the floor. it drops into 3rd and just around 80 it is ready to shift, it attempts and takes about 3 seconds before it goes into gear. it goes in smooth... just takes a while to get into gear. o, then when i am just driving around city if i accelerate say from 30mph and let off the gas it slams into 4th. depends on different situations. sometimes smooth. sometimes hard. always long at high speeds.

It is running normally, with the exception of going into gear late. That is called a delayed engagement into drive/reverse. There happens to be a TSB on this (forget which number though). Check the fluid while it is hot. It must be at the top HOT line for it to shift right.

[PSUsouthpaw]

Okay, I can get ahokd of a trans cooler from the local advance auto, but where can I find the inline tranny fluid filter?

[mrphotoman]

I need to get a tranny cooler. anyone have experience with any brands they can recommend to me? i know some even have fans on them to keep it really cool.

[bms231]

check out jegs. they have some really inexpesive brand name tranny coolers. tell me how the install goes b/c i really want one myself for as hard as i drive.

[cclngthr]

Okay, I can get ahokd of a trans cooler from the local advance auto, but where can I find the inline tranny fluid filter?

The Magnefine transmission cooler line filters http://www.magnefine.com/ are available at most transmission shops.

I need to get a tranny cooler. anyone have experience with any brands they can recommend to me? i know some even have fans on them to keep it really cool.

I had a Hayden 1401 cooler on my XD.

Check out my DIY's on Elantraclub. I wrote both DIY's for the cooler install and the filter.

One word of caution with the cooler. The tranny must have an operating temperature of 180 degrees. 195 degrees is getting too hot. If you have the fluid flowing from the trans to the radiator, then the cooler, it would make the fluid too cold. Having the fluid run to the external cooler first then to the radiator is your best bet so the fluid temp will be regulated to that 180 degree number. If it gets too cold, shifting problems will occur.

[lostdestiny14]

So is there any effective way to upgrade the automatic that will be trustworthy and last for awhile?

TC from Nextgen took tibby03's tranny apart. They found that the auto tranny is actually pretty strong, it just needs a new valvetrain system basically. And we're all waiting anxiously for this to come out.

Til then we have auto tranny coolers which alot of the 250whp+ autos dont have. And a TRQ convertor from nextgen or levelten. There are people with level tens and never had a problem.

I have a auto N/A because Im too poor to go FI lol. Im not disappointed in how it runs. Just makes it more fun when I pull up next to someone after beating them in a race and tell them that.

[PSUsouthpaw]

is that a tranny from an I4 or a v6, and how different are the two?

[lostdestiny14]

Its a v6, one of the fastest out there actually. Hopefully11's soon. Im not sre but I thought the auto tranny was the same for the i4 and v6.

[PSUsouthpaw]

Its a v6, one of the fastest out there actually. Hopefully11's soon. Im not sre but I thought the auto tranny was the same for the i4 and v6.

If thats the case, than my life just got 100X easier...because that means...wait...that means the bolt pattern would be the same on the 2.7 engine and the 2.0...and...the 6-speed might just bolt up to the 2.0...hmmm....:smile:

[mac11]

If thats the case, than my life just got 100X easier...because that means...wait...that means the bolt pattern would be the same on the 2.7 engine and the 2.0...and...the 6-speed might just bolt up to the 2.0...hmmm....:smile:

no
stop
right now

[PSUsouthpaw]

no
stop
right now

One can wish.

Ah well, if its the same tranny as the v6, than I'm not as worried about it anymore.

[mac11]

its not, the bolt pattern is not the same. there are some 4cyl guys in korea with a 6spd but its not the same trans as on the v6. The 4cyl doesnt need a 6 spd. The 5 speed is geared fairy well for its power band, i just think it cruises a little to high in 5th. it just needs more power, in which you will want the taller gears anyway.

[cclngthr]

The I4 and V6 transmissions are very different from each other, not only bolt pattern and also the internals. The V6 trans has extra clutch packs, and slightly larger ones along with a larger fluid capacity.

The torque converters from a/m companies might not work well with the stock internals, which is designed for the stock TC. When you change 1 part, you must think about the entire unit as a whole, and figure out on the long term if it will last. Sure, short term it might work, but it can cause more wear on the clutches as a result.

On my 07 Elantra, which has the auto, I have a variable line pressure solenoid and sensor. Here, instead of using a pump dependent line pressure system, my tranny can adjust the pressure depending on what the ECU sees as wear and slippage. How this works is the ecu reduces the pressure right before the shift until right after the shift to prevent wear on the mechanical components. It still grabs the next higher gear during the shift, but the wear is reduced. The older Hyundais use a rpm dependent line pressure system.

[lostdestiny14]

Aw now Im corrected, thanks

[Mines Better]

One word of caution with the cooler. The tranny must have an operating temperature of 180 degrees. 195 degrees is getting too hot. If you have the fluid flowing from the trans to the radiator, then the cooler, it would make the fluid too cold. Having the fluid run to the external cooler first then to the radiator is your best bet so the fluid temp will be regulated to that 180 degree number. If it gets too cold, shifting problems will occur.
...interesting...

wouldnt u think that if shifting problems would occur if it wasnt warm enough then u would basically almost always have shifting problems, considering it takes a few hard runs to even warm up the tranny fluid?

anywho, if that really is the case, then it seems like there's no point of getting a tranny cooler...if 195 is too hot, but it cant go lower than 180....id either have to question that...or just get rid of my tranny cooler that i've had and never installed...lol.

on that note, they are really easy to install, for anyone who was curious.

[mac11]

...interesting...

wouldnt u think that if shifting problems would occur if it wasnt warm enough then u would basically almost always have shifting problems, considering it takes a few hard runs to even warm up the tranny fluid?

anywho, if that really is the case, then it seems like there's no point of getting a tranny cooler...if 195 is too hot, but it cant go lower than 180....id either have to question that...or just get rid of my tranny cooler that i've had and never installed...lol.

on that note, they are really easy to install, for anyone who was curious.



Well all tranny fluids dont necessarily have that operating range. What you should do is find the operating range of the fluid you are running. Then before just going ahead and installing your tranny cooler you should put a tranny fluid temp gauge on and monitor your tranny fluid temps. If you are staying within your operating range at all times then you dont really need the tranny cooler. If you are constantly running within a couple of degrees of the upper bound or if you are actually overheating then, well obviously, get that cooler on there.

[Mines Better]

honestly, i think for someone like me who's at the track almost every weekend its worth it...but for someone who isnt, then its not.

it take a while under just normal driving conditions for the tranny fluid to even reach 'hot' temperatures...

[mac11]

1st it doesnt take all that long.

2nd if i ever were to put a tranny cooler in i would thermostat regulate it so i wasnt cooling cold oil. That is going to increase the time it takes to warm it up. You would also cool it back down past where you are going to want to it at between runs.

[FlyRyde]

I'll try to get as much info as I can for you guys, cause APE is running an auto tranny built up to run 600+ whp and its moving the car to 10.7 secs down the strip already. He's shootin for 9s now.

[mrphotoman]

I want your software/transmission controller reflash for my auto!

[Jalmir]

You can find 92 Sonata tranny cooler for cheap out there, got mine for 13$.

[cclngthr]

...interesting...

wouldnt u think that if shifting problems would occur if it wasnt warm enough then u would basically almost always have shifting problems, considering it takes a few hard runs to even warm up the tranny fluid?

anywho, if that really is the case, then it seems like there's no point of getting a tranny cooler...if 195 is too hot, but it cant go lower than 180....id either have to question that...or just get rid of my tranny cooler that i've had and never installed...lol.

on that note, they are really easy to install, for anyone who was curious.

It depends on HOW the cooler is connected to the system. If it is connected AFTER the radiator cooler, the fluid would be too cold. On my 03 XD, I had the cooler installed and found the cooler cooled the fluid too much (I have a GDS scan tool the dealers use) if I had the aux cooler hooked up after the radiator cooler (which the directions recommend). When I had it hooked up this way, the fluid was 156 degrees; well below the 180 degree minimum. When I had the cooler hooked BEFORE the radiator, the temp on the scan tool was 175 (closer to the minimum), but was acceptable. Here, the temp was near 180, but the fluid temp was regulated with the radiator cooler to warm up the fluid if it got too cold. I had this configuration on my XD and I did not have any shifting problems. I did when it was hooked up the other way. It would shudder and go past the rev limiter before it shifted when the fluid ran too cold.

Well all tranny fluids dont necessarily have that operating range. What you should do is find the operating range of the fluid you are running. Then before just going ahead and installing your tranny cooler you should put a tranny fluid temp gauge on and monitor your tranny fluid temps. If you are staying within your operating range at all times then you dont really need the tranny cooler. If you are constantly running within a couple of degrees of the upper bound or if you are actually overheating then, well obviously, get that cooler on there.

If you can get a T fitting for the trans temp gauge sensor on the push line, you should be able to get a fairly accurate reading. The trans does have a temp sensor in the tranny, which the ECU uses to monitor the fluid temp. On my 68 Chev truck, which has the commercial grade Allission transmission, has a temp gauge sensor on the external filter housing. Although getting an external filter the size of a **** isn't necessary on the Hyundai, you should be able to have a T fitting made for the cooler line.

[chaosripper]

what does everyone typically do to get the best times at the track? what about on the street?

last time when i didnt have my s/c i just left it in shifttronic and floored it, seemed to get the best times that way

on the street, now with my s/c, i usually just shift to the lowest possible gear and just get on it. from a stop i usually just give about 3/4 gas at the start then floor it